1754 From: Simon Dicon Montford <sdm@e...>
Date: Mon Aug 28, 2000 8:25am
Subject: dignitaries and important personalities
Originally from http://www.sahajayoga.org/Events/, which was down as of May 12, 2007:
"Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi's Tour of North America during the month of June, 2000 marked a breakthrough for the American public, drawing thousands at each of the six public programs (New York, Los Angeles, Washington DC, Toronto, Vancouver, and Berkeley, California), as well as dignitaries and important personalities at the VIP reception on June 22nd in New York City."
M: Sounds like Hitler arrival at Munich This vague use (ultra-generic indeed)of "thousands" can be anything from 2 thousand to 90 thousand. But we know from facts that they might be - at best 2 thousand - and of these nearly 1 thousand are SY. Apart of that we hear once again the pathetic ring of marketing "triumphalism".
SD: VIP reception? So which "dignitaries and important personalities" showed up?
M: So which "dignitaries and important personalities" showed up? Madonna? Bill Gates? Sting? Michael Jordan? The Rothchilds?
Originally from http://www.sahajayoga.org/Events/2000TourImpressions.html, which was down as of May 12, 2007:
"Shri Mataji said that the only two diseases which are really hard to cure are AIDS and the Alzheimer disease, mostly due to the negative/aggressive attitude of the patients which makes it difficult for them to receive and accept their Self Realization."
SD: Same ol' crapola.
M: Known cases of agressive AIDSians running after Mataji kicking her and/or shouting names at her? What about fierce Alzheimerists furiously guiding their wheel-chairs intent on erasing Mataji or members of her brigade?
To support that affirmation (that implies that she has huge scores of successful healing)she has to show her impressive numbers concerning healing "easy diseases" like all forms of cancer, and all cardio and angiopathies, not to mention siphilis, tuberculosis, diabetes and the Indian disease "diarrehia". And her own: constipation.
O, blame it on the decay of enlightenment. Besides, the show must go on, play on the same ol'music.
1756 From: Isabel Martenson <imartenson@y...> Date: Wed Aug 30, 2000 0:25am Subject: RE: Fw: [SY] questions
I guess Maslow would say that when we have all our 'lower' needs met then our minds can turn to 'self-actualisation'. I dunno.
Isa: Is Maslow the one who wrote about the pyramid of needs?? Looking back at my vast experience of life ;-) Id have to say that when I have financial/physical difficulties thats all I think of, I dont turn to spirituality at all, I remain on that base level, but when other, higher needs arent satisfied I tend to turn to spirituality.
When Ive felt lonely or isolated for example Ive always turned to the spiritual, not purposefully, because of a need to join a group, but somehow when Ive been surrounded by friends and loved ones and really enjoying myself I havent felt so much the need to discover ultimate truths. So if spiritual love is a substitute for earthly love, is earthly love of higher value? Answer me that one for ten points Cambridge. Ok, Ill get back to work now. Isa 1757 From: Miguel Henriques <migcah@h...> Date: Wed Aug 30, 2000 2:51am Subject: RE: Fw: [SY] questions
Dear Isa, perhaps this duality spirituality/ materiality is not conducive to zero experience mind. this zero experience mind is one who sees every situation as new, and does not interpret it according to a set frame of reference. Seeing unconditionally then is true seeing. The path of seeing does not separate lower from higher. Indeed lower is higher , higher is lower. Everyday life contains all. Every situation (whether pleasant, painful or neutral) is the teacher.
So those who set "spiritual" over a pedestal and against "material" are on a wrong track: the priest path. This world right now is joyfully divine and does not need external divinities. May be enlightenment is breakthrough from all kinds of spiritualities. They are an unneeded byproduct. In short the Spirit has no "spirituality" that can be named. That's why all Yogas and Mahayogas are paths to be discarded. That's why the Zen path is said to be a no-path path. There's no ultimate sandal. Regards, Miguel de CH
1758 From: Britt <brittbaumann@h...> Date: Wed Aug 30, 2000 5:07am Subject: Re: Fw: [SY] questions
So if spiritual love is a substitute for earthly love, is earthly love of higher value? Answer me that one for ten points Cambridge. Perhaps Earthly Love is Spiritual Love. The love shared between friends, family and spouse is of the highest value but the conterfeit love is the one reaping meaningless sexual gratification from strangers....or for that matter meaningless, empty love from a guru.
1759 From: Jane Pickup <jane@h...> Date: Wed Aug 30, 2000 7:44am Subject: Re: Fw: [SY] questions
I can't comment on the first question(because I don't really understand it! However, I must say I agree wholeheartedly with the other comment regarding "counterfit "love" reaping meaningless sexual gratification from strangers!"
If only people had such a burning "urge" to show genuine love and kindess towards their fellow men and women as they do for the kind just mentioned - the world would be a much nicer place!! Jane Pickup
1761 From: Simon Dicon Montford <sdm@e...> Date: Thu Aug 31, 2000 2:15am Subject: RE: [xsy] FW: Testimonial Supporting Sahaja Yoga
Email from current SY member received by Freedom of Mind on August 14, 2000
Hi Just read your page on Sahaja Yoga.
I've been "in" since 1983 and have practised SY in England, India and Australia.
I'd just like to say that SY is for ever evolving... so the many ridiculous actions of the big leaders of the 1980s do not happen now (not to my knowledge anyway.) The cruel and unjust actions reported at www.sahaja-yoga.org did not only happen in the 1980s but continue to the present day.
SD: They were not only perpetrated by leaders of Sahaja Yoga, but also Shri Mataji, the Guru, "Supreme Goddess" and major beneficiary of Sahaja Yoga.
Secondly, SY evolves in different ways in different countries - which is something Judith Coney in her PhD thesis/book on SY in England failed to understand.
SD: In fact differences between countries are discussed by Dr Judith Coney in her PhD thesis and book. The subject is also a major theme of her 1995 article 'Belonging to a Global Religion': The Sociological Dimensions of International Elements in Sahaja Yoga, *Journal of Contemporary Religion*, Vol. 10, No. 2, p. 109.
I am not brainwashed, and still retain my critical faculties Critical faculties can be selective.(having been awarded two Masters degrees at a major Australian university in the 1990s),
SD: Unfortunately academic honours are no defence against cult membership. Most cults have MDs, PhDs, etc among their membership.
nor do I accept everything said in the name of SY.
SD: The acid test is whether you accept everything said by Shri Mataji. Do you accept her claim that babies that cry in front of her (or her photograph) are possessed? Do you accept her claim that Indians have extra genes protecting them from 'sins against the Father' and 'sins against the Mother'? Do you accept her claim that she is not benefitting financially from Sahaja Yoga? Do you accept her claim that she is the Supreme Goddess who created the universe?
For me, there has to be a reason for any SY practise I engage in - mantras, footsoaking, whatever - in the end my constant question to myself is: does this way of life make me a better person, do I benefit? So far, the answer has been yes.
SD: People can use the same argument for involvement in organisations like the Nazi party. In the end it is down to personal choice. Incorrect. There is an ethical dimension because your support for the guru and the organisation affects the lives of others, especially if you are involved in recruitment activities, donate money, or attend money-making events like pujas and India Tours.
Personally I feel it is unfair that the actions of the minority in the 1980s in certain countries, should still be visited on everyone else in the year 2000.
SD: The main concern of www.sahaja-yoga.org is Shri Mataji's own behaviour: her cruelty, injustice and multi-million dollar profiteering. The financial report at: http://mitglied.tripod.de/Sahaja_Yoga_Facts/mneytxt.htm concerns Sahaja Yoga finances at the end of 1999.
Ps. Beware selective quoting from Shri Mataji's book, or indeed any book. You just make yourself look foolish to those who have read the book in its entirety.
SD: Critics of Sahaja Yoga would welcome the full text of the book being made available on the Internet. It would do more than we ever could to publicise the abusurdity of Mataji's ideas. Previously there was a book called *The Kingdom of God* freely available at www.adishakti.org that espoused equally absurd ideas. Unfortunately Shri Mataji decreed that the book be taken off the Internet and privately published.
Best wishes, Simon M <sdm@e...>